Unchanging God

Sovereign Grace Music records songs that are meant to be sung in local churches, not just listened to. In this episode, Bob and David talk about how they have utilized the songs from Unchanging God, Vol. 1 in their Sunday meetings at Sovereign Grace Church of Louisville. 

Unchanging God: Songs From the Book of Psalms, Volume 1
Unchanging God: Meditations on Psalms and Songs

Psalm 145
Exodus 34:6
Psalm 119:129-136
Psalm 103
Romans 8:38-39
Psalm 93
Colossians 3:16
Psalm 62
Psalm 121
Luke 21:16

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David Zimmer: Welcome to Sound Plus Doctrine, the podcast of Sovereign Grace Music where we explore what the Bible has to say about music and worship in the church and encourage those who plan, lead, and participate in their Sunday gatherings each week.

DZ: Hello, welcome to the Sound Plus Doctrine Podcast. My name is David Zimmer.

Bob Kauflin: My name is Bob Kauflin. And David, today we are talking about something that you came up with the idea for.

DZ: Yeah, I’m excited.

BK: We’re talking about… Of course you’re excited you came up with the idea. [laughter] How we use the songs from Unchanging God, Volume One. You sent me an email the other day. Tell us how this came to be.

DZ: Yeah. Many years ago you wrote a blog post.

BK: If I wrote a blog post, it was many, many years ago. [laughter] That’s true.

DZ: About Sooner Count the Stars, which is a great album. You… In the blog post you talked about, “Here are the songs on the album, here’s what it says, and here’s how we use it.” And I thought man, that is so great, because so often people will hear a single re-release and go, “I’ll take that one.”

BK: Yeah. Well and a lot of people are… Us included, are releasing songs as singles.

DZ: Yeah. And we love that. We love that it’s getting out to you, but we also want to release seven songs. We wanna release 14 songs. We wanna have a lot of songs that say different things. Because there’s so many different uses and different contexts that you could use those songs in, like a call to worship, like a confessional song, like a benediction. And so I just thought it’d be fun to talk about just one of our volumes, so Volume One of Unchanging God. Where did the song come from, and how do we use it in Sovereign Grace Church of Louisville on Sundays?

BK: Yes. And one of our hopes in doing this is not just to introduce you if you don’t know them, to the songs we’ve done on this album, but also to help us think more carefully about the fact that songs actually say things. So if you’re a leader, you’re not just putting a song that’s a hit in your liturgy, in your collections, in your service. You’re picking songs that are saying something. And so, what do these songs say? So for this album, David, you and I contributed to six of the seven songs on it, so I thought this would be a great one to do, to work with. But as we’re thinking about these songs, we wanna talk about, where the song began, as you mentioned, what it means, and then how we might use it in a meeting.

BK: So, the first one, “How Great,” based on Psalm 145. I wrote this with my son Jordan and Nate Stiff contributed as well. Psalm 145 is just one of my favorite Psalms. It’s hard to pick favorite Psalms ’cause there are 150 of them, but it has always stood out to me as one that is just exuberant in the expression of praise. It’s un… It’s relentless, it’s just a torrent of praise. And not all the Psalms are like that. This is the only Psalm in the Psalter that is entitled a Song of Praise. So it’s the only one of David’s Psalms that’s entitled a Song of Praise. Which is interesting. There’s something about it that captures the heart of praise like few Psalms do.

BK: And it comes at the end of a lot of Psalms that talk about celebration sure and praise, yes, but also being persecuted and being opposed and being sick and songs of confession and songs of lament and all these songs we wanna sing as we live. But I preached on this Psalm and I called it praise fit for a king. And the heart behind that was just saying that, if you see God as a king like no other, you won’t rest until he has praise like no other. ‘Cause verse three says, “Great is the Lord and greatly to be praised and his greatness is unsearchable.” So when I was starting to work on this, I got all those hymns that had been written on the song, and you find them in some Psalters. And then I did a spread chart of, “This is what it says about God. This is what it says about how we should respond.” And just wanted to capture somehow, what this Psalm says and express musically the full engagement that these words imply. And so, it begins with, “Each day I awake, from dawn to setting sun I’m gonna proclaim your greatness.” And then the Psalm says in verse four, “One generation shall commend your works to another.” And I wanted to get something about that, about generations singing together. This isn’t just about us.

BK: Another aspect of the Psalm is, it talks about how the Lord is good to all and has… His mercies overall that he has made. But he’s also good to those with whom he is in covenant. And in the middle of the Psalm, David quotes what God said to Moses in Exodus 34, “The Lord is gracious and merciful, slow to anger and abounding in steadfast love.” Something that he said to his people. And at the end of the Psalm, we have specific references to how the Lord relates to his people. “The Lord is near to all who call on him in truth. He fulfills the desire of those who fear him. The Lord preserves all who love him.” So I wanted to get that aspect in as well. And then the last thing I wanted to include was just… It’s a little phrase near the end of the Psalm, you have all this joy, these great things the Lord does for us. The Lord preserves all who love him, verse 20, but all the wicked he will destroy. We can often forget in talking about God being a God of steadfast love and mercy and compassion and a good father and gracious and all those things, he’s a God of justice. And if he wasn’t a God of justice, he wouldn’t be a good God. God hates evil, He’s opposed to it. The Bible is filled with references to how much God hates evil.

BK: So there will be a day when God destroys the works of wicked men, and we will rejoice because evil will be done with forever. So this is… The verses originally had a different verse, we had done it in our church, Sovereign Grace Church of Louisville for a while. And then I found out from some of the people in the band that they really didn’t like the verse, the melody to the verse. So we changed it, Jordan came up with the chorus, Nate helped with the words and we use this as a call to worship.

DZ: Yes.

BK: It is…

DZ: It is a great call to worship.

BK: It doesn’t go into the gospel. It’s just saying, “God is great, he’s greatly to be praised. Let’s lift up our voices. That’s what they sing.”

DZ: Yeah, that’s great. So great.

BK: How great?

DZ: Great.

BK: Okay, thanks. [laughter] All right, “Your Words are Wonderful.” Song number two, you were a part of the writing of the song, so let’s… How did it start?

DZ: Yeah. Nate Stiff and I wrote this together. You will hear Nate’s name a lot on this podcast.

BK: You will.

DZ: You’ve seen his name before. He’s just a prolific writer, good friend, member of Sovereign Grace Church of Louisville. We’re so happy.

BK: Praise the Lord as of two years ago.

DZ: So yeah. Obviously not based on the entire Psalm 119 [laughter]

BK: That would be a really long song.

DZ: And I’m glad you didn’t write that song.

BK: Yes. But it is, specifically honing in on verses 129 through 136. “Your testimonies are wonderful, therefore, my soul keeps them.” We really wanted to write a song that captured the beauty of God’s word, the importance of God’s word, but also what his word… How his word is informing our thoughts, how we think through things.

DZ: How we, how we’re processing that inside voice, especially if it’s coming from the enemy. In verse two, you have, “Lord guard us from the lies the enemy will speak. No guilt remains for those you have redeemed.” If you’re coming in on a Sunday morning thinking, I’ve just been listening to myself. I’ve been listening to the lies. We wanna just recalibrate, re-anchor into God’s word. And I think of Psalm 119:133. “Keep steady my steps according to your promise, and let no iniquity get dominion over me.” We just want to be steadfast in God’s word, because it is our hope. It’s our anchor. And even taking it a step further, we wanted the bridge to say something that is, if we’ve been listening to these lies, if we’ve been believing the lies, we wanna open our eyes and see, give us the eyes to see. Give us the ears to hear. Help us when we’re doubting. Help us in our own belief.

BK: ’cause that’s where we live.

DZ: That’s where we live. And so it’s, we were really proud of how it turned out. And then Ben Shive really helped us, at the last minute on the bridge.

BK: This is, we were rehearsing the songs for the album and you were working on it [laughter]

DZ: Yes. And sometimes people think that a song. Yeah, we just write in five minutes, and then we put it on the album. Guys, it takes sometimes years to dial in a song and go, okay, it’s ready. We can put it on.

BK: They’ve heard that from others as well.

DZ: Yeah. So this was a joy to write.

BK: I love that it speaks to our affections as well as our obedience. Because you never have those separated in God’s word.

DZ: Well said.

BK: Your words are wonderful, great. But come write your holy truth upon our longing heart, strengthen us to shine against the dark. This isn’t just about God’s word, making us feel better about life and things. It’s about learning his ways. And Psalm 119 is filled with the Psalmist response, both of, I love your law. I love your words, and teach me your ways.

DZ: Yes, I need it.

BK: Let me walk in your paths. How shall a young man keep his way pure by hiding your word in my heart. Messed that up, but Psalm, “how can a young man keep his way pure by guarding it according to your word.” And “Your words have I hidden in my heart, that I might not sin against you.” So there is this all-encompassing effect the word is to have on us. And we just don’t have enough songs like this. So we’ve used this, I remember after a message that Jeff Purswell preached on the word.

BK: We sang it and Jeff came up to us afterwards and came to me and said, that was a great song, that’s a great song. I said, it’s one of ours, Jeff [laughter] But we’ve used it in the context of the meeting as well. Just any time that we wanna highlight the effect of God’s words. These aren’t just dry doctrines. They’re God’s presenting himself to us. He wants to give us not just information, but as Jeff says, he wants to build relationship. And so this song does that wonderfully. So thanks for writing it.

DZ: Yes. It was a joy.

BK: You wrote another one. “Bless the Lord O My Soul.” This one was Dave Fournier.

DZ: Yes, Dave Fournier brought these lyrics to a writer’s retreat.

BK: One of our annual songwriter’s retreats?

DZ: Yeah. And there’s great songs based off of Psalm 103.

BK: Psalm 103 is a pretty, pretty good text to write from.

DZ: It’s a great text. But these words were just so fresh to me. And so I sat down with the lyrics and I started to write different melodies that I thought would match. There’s a lot of lyrics in this song.

BK: It’s a wordy song.

DZ: It’s a wordy song. But when I got to verse two and read, “our days will fade like flowers and are quickly spent, and like the wind, our years will come and go.” I thought of Bob Dylan. I thought of folk music and…

BK: “The answer, my friend is blowing in the wind,” [laughter] That’s what I think of. And the wind, our years will come and go. So I get it.

DZ: So I felt like, yeah, maybe more of a country or folk feel for this song will kinda give the heart of the song, which is in all seasons, God is faithful. God is merciful and he is gracious. And a line that always sticks out to me every single time I’ve sung it is, “from endless springs of Kindness, all his blessings flow.” It’s just count the ways he’s been gracious. Count the ways he has been kind and it’s a joy to write this song. It was a joy to sing this song. And then I love verse three. It just expands into, we are just joining in on what heaven is already doing. Blessing the Lord and all creatures are going to bow and bless the Lord.

BK: This reminds me of a quote I forgot to share when I was talking about Psalm 145 J.I Packer in commenting on how God is, good to all, but in specific ways to his beloved. He says, “God is good to all in some ways and to some in all ways.” And so for those who are just living, God is good to everyone. He causes…

DZ: Yes. Common grace.

BK: His rain to fall on the evil and the just. But for those who have trusted in Christ, he’s good to them, in all ways, “everlasting favor is his covenant.” I will tell his goodness through eternity. It reminds me of Romans 8. “For I’m sure that nothing will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus for I’m sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers nor height, nor depth, nor anything else in all creation will be, that’s the whole verse. Will be able to separate us from the love of God and Christ Jesus our Lord.” That’s the confidence we have. And I love that the music is so complimentary to these words. It does have that relaxed feel of this is just true about my life. Everlasting favor is the covenant God has made with me. He doesn’t change. That’s why we call the album Unchanging God. He doesn’t change like shifting shadows. He is constant. We may experience different things, but he does not change.

DZ: Amen.

BK: So this is a great call to worship as well.

DZ: Yeah. A call to worship. And it also could be really confessional too, as a second or third song, just, “All of my betrayals, he will not repay.” It’s his mercy and his kindness that draws us to himself.

BK: “He covers my transgressions like the snow.” It does. It gets a lot of work done. Confession, assurance of pardon and then looking forward to our heavenly inheritance. So, great. “The Lord Almighty Reigns,” Psalm 93. This began with Nate Stiff as a lot of songs do. He was working out with Jon Althoff and I think brought me in somewhere along the process. I’m not even sure what I contributed to this. But my name is on it…


DZ: It does get blurry and in songwriter retreats.

BK: Oh. So I just, I remember talking to Nate about what the song should say when it first, when he first wrote it, it felt a little more like a lullaby. And the Psalm is just not a lullaby. He wanted to communicate the rest that trusting in God provides. But it’s a strong rest. I remember being in Australia one time on the shore watching the waves crash against a wall. And these words came to mind. “The floods have lifted up. Oh Lord. The floods have lifted up their voice, the floods lift up their roaring mightier than the thunders of many waters, mightier than the waves of the sea. The Lord on high is mighty”. There is strength. And no matter how strong or how mighty the waves may seem, or the flood may seem, or the storm may seem, the Lord’s mightier still. [laughter] And I remember when we recorded this, we sent out recordings to the people who were gonna come to the event so that they could sing along.

DZ: Yes. Sing.

BK: And I received a Facebook message from one dad who said, “Yeah, we’ve been singing this song. There’s like a storm going on outside our house. And we were singing this song. And it’s so great to know that he’s stronger than the seas. He reigns when ocean’s roar, he reigns above the storm.” And that’s the effect this song is meant to have. And I remember, do you remember when we were writing the bridge, “wind and waves are stilled in reverence, thunder trembles on your presence, you will hold us in the tempest,” because these truths are meant to affect us. They’re not just doctrines. They’re meant to have some impact on us. And the end of the bridge is, “you will not be moved.” You will hold us in the tempest and you will not be moved. [laughter], you will not be moved, say it four times. You will not be moved, moved ’cause you reign. All your ways, they’re good for us. And we will never be separated from your goodness again, just that assurance that the one who reigns overall carries us in his heart.

BK: So He reigns. It’s a good thing. We haven’t used this as a call to worship more like a response song, although it doesn’t talk about the gospel. It assures us of God’s protection and his care regardless of what’s going on in our lives. So when life is falling apart, when everything is out control, when up is down, down is up. He reigns above the storm. He is faithful to his promise ever here with us. So that’s the little way wave.

DZ: A lot of songs on this album are tracing that theme of his sovereignty, his unchanging nature, obviously. But it’s actually really, it’s just fascinating to hear how it made it into all of the songs. And it’s because the Psalms are talking about his care, his sovereign care.

BK: God wants us to know who he is. And when we get together, when we gather as the church to sing, we’re not just expressing our thoughts. We’re not just expressing our emotions. That’s an aspect of singing where we are teaching and admonishing one another. Even there it’s well with thankfulness in our hearts, Colossians 3:16, there is an expressiveness to it, but it is a teaching and admonishing. We are reminding ourselves who God is, what he said, and why it matters. Which brings us to the next song.

DZ: Excellent.

BK: “From Everlasting” Neither you or I participate in this, but I remember the first time I heard it again at a songwriter retreat. This is written by Lisa Clow and Lacy, now Condy, who recently gave birth to twins, by the way.

DZ: Yes.

BK: And is doing well. It used to be Lacy Hudson, but they sang this song and I walked into the room and I just thought, that is so engaging. And actually at that time, the song was in a 6/8 feel. “Oh God. Before the mountains were brought forth… ” When Ben Shive heard it, he thought, you know what, you should straighten that out. And so that’s how we did it on the album.

BK: And I remember, oh. It’s just such a great song, just glorying in the fact that God is everlasting, we are not. “Lord, you have been our dwelling place in all generations before the mountains were brought forth, wherever you had formed the earth and the world, from everlasting to everlasting, you are God.” So they teased out what difference that makes.

DZ: Right.

BK: In the chorus, “All our days are held within your hands. Your perfect love and favor, have no end. We rest within the wisdom of your plan, everlasting, God.” And I remember when we were looking at it, talking actually on the day of the recording, not rehearsal.

DZ: Oh, that’s right. Yeah.

BK: Day of the recording…

DZ: Fast forward.

BK: Looking at this passage where it says…

BK: “We are brought to an end by your anger, by your wrath we are dismayed. You have set our iniquities before you and our secret sins in light of your presence.” Something about, I wanted to capture something of the fact that God in his everlasting-ness sees everything we do.

BK: He knows our ways, he sees our sins, our iniquities they’re all before him. And how do we deal with that? So the line we ended up with, which I think is just very succinctly states, what they were trying to say, “O God of light, our ways are known to you. But by Your grace, You’re making all things new.” So there’s that gospel hope in there. You look like you’re…

DZ: Excellent.

BK: About to say something about our devotional.

DZ: Yes.

BK: Why don’t you say something about it.

DZ: Yes. So, I wanted to just call our attention to a devotional that we put out around the time the album came out. And basically it’s a companion to the album.

BK: Yep.

DZ: And I actually wanted to highlight what one of our pastors said based on Psalm 90.

BK: Oh, great.

DZ: All of our pastors in Sovereign Grace Churches wrote…

BK: Some of the pastors in Sovereign Grace Churches.

DZ: Yes.

BK: Not all of them. [laughter]

DZ: Oh, yeah, yeah. Some of the pastors wrote specifically about each psalm. So this has been just a really awesome resource. So you have the whole psalm, and then you have the lyrics, and then you turn the page and you have a reflection. And Bill Patton, one of our pastors wrote…

BK: Convenant Fellowship in Glen Mills, Pennsylvania

DZ: Yes. Wrote this that I just wanted to share.

BK: Yeah.

DZ: “Though our lives are punctuated with sorrows and proceed relentlessly toward physical death, God’s love for us will endure as long as he endures.”

BK: Oh, amen.

DZ: “As we wait for Christ to return and make all things new, the everlasting God sovereignly, governs each of our days with perfect wisdom. He helps us number our days, verse 12. And establishes the work of our hands, verse 17, bestowing them with eternal significance.”

BK: Oh.

DZ: I just think that’s great.

BK: It’s so great.

DZ: And there’s a prayer in here and there’s some questions that you can go through if you have a team, if you’re going through with a team or just for yourself. But both volumes, volume one and two are in this book.

BK: Yes.

DZ: And it’s available to purchase, we’re gonna put it in the link below.

BK: And David, thank you for coming up with this idea ’cause we always want our songs to do more than just provide songs to sing on Sunday mornings. We want them to teach, and this devotion is a great accompaniment to the albums.

DZ: Oh, I’ve read it multiple times. I’ve been so encouraged by it.

BK: Alright. Next song, “My Soul Will Wait.” Psalms 62, this began with Keaton Bunting, who I think is 23 years old. And this is her first song on a Sovereign Grace album. She’s the daughter of Keith Bunting, a good friend who’s pastor of Sovereign Grace Church in Melbourne, Florida. And it actually began when we heard it, at the songwriter retreat. Is that where we first heard it?

DZ: Yes.

BK: It was actually. Well, everybody thought, “This is a great song.”

DZ: “This is a great song.” Yeah. It might need a little bit of work, but this is, there.

BK: Yes. Yes. It was actually based at that time on Psalm 61 and 62. And so I spent some time with her. My name’s on the song just ’cause I did a little bit of stuff, but it’s mostly Keaton’s song.

BK: And the thing I wanna highlight is that so often when we think of waiting for the Lord to deliver us, there’s a sadness to it or just a some soberness sobriety. And even the Psalm itself talks about how for God, verse 5, “For God alone, oh my soul wait in silence for my hope is from Him.”

DZ: Yeah.

BK: There’s just a somberness to it. But Keaton, in writing this song wanted to communicate something of the confidence that we have while we’re waiting. And it doesn’t have to be just, Okay, I’m just gonna bear with this kind of a fatalistic, all right.

DZ: Right. Right.

BK: But in active trust in God.

DZ: Yes. Yes.

BK: I mean, it says, “He only is my rock and my salvation, my fortress. I shall not be shaken.” [laughter] And then, “Trust in him at all times, oh people.” He looks outward. “Pour out your heart before him. God is a refuge for us.” So this is more of a pouring out our heart before him and confessing these things we know to be true in the midst of the enemy surrounding and darkness overwhelming and…

DZ: Yep.

BK: Love the psalmist, the way the psalmist says it. “How long will all of you attack a man to batter him? Like a leaning wall, a tottering fence.” I’m about to go down. Hey, but let me tell you something, I am not going down. Because the Lord is my solid rock and my salvation.

BK: ” So I just, I love the way that that strength comes through, both in the lyrics and the music. And then in verse 3, “How we come to the gospel.” Which is the foundation of that secure love. “This is love I can’t explain. This is mercy unreserved through your sacrifice so great on the cross, I have peace that’s undeserved.”

BK: And then these three lines, “For the battle has been won. I fear no shame or loss. Now the sting of death is gone. You are my solid.” Oh man. I just love singing this song. [laughter] And then it ends with that verse 8, “Trust in him at all times. Pouring out our hearts before you. We will trust in you perfect savior, strong defender. We will trust in you.”

DZ: Yeah.

BK: So we have used this numerous times, response to a message.

DZ: Call to worship.

BK: Call to worship, during the songs it just kinda reminds us as songs are meant to do, who God is, what He’s done, why it matters.

DZ: Yes. And I remember, just as a side note, I remember we didn’t have the tag originally. Keaton had written it…

BK: That’s right.

DZ: And we didn’t have it ’cause we were trying to…

BK: This song was like 10 minutes long. It was really long.

DZ: And you still might think that, but… Yeah. But it’s constantly moving. The song is constantly driving.

DZ: Yes.

DZ: And it never lets up and when you finally get to the end, it’s just a beautiful time. We don’t really have that, where we have a song and then we get to respond. To the song we sang. It’s typically a different song. I love that this tag is here. And I love that we repeated. It’s just like, let’s sit in this for a moment, responding to what we’ve received.

BK: Well, it’s just a different response to who the Lord is. In the song we’re in the first part of the song, we’re saying, you’re my rock, my salvation, my steadfast hope. And then it, that’s bold and confident. And then the end, it’s just, we’re reflecting on it. Perfect Savior. Strong defender. We’re gonna trust you.

DZ: Yes.

BK: No matter what comes. I love that. Alright. And it’s just, it’s exciting to me that it has been so well received both in English and in Spanish. In fact there are more views on YouTube for the Spanish version right now than the English version. But that’s not surprising. [laughter] but yeah, it resonates in people’s hearts. Okay. Last song, “He Will Keep You”, Yeah. From Psalm 121, this another song began at a song writers retreat.

DZ: Yeah. I remember I was on your piano and I was wanting to write a song that was a benediction. A send you out into the week kind of song. And I was really inspired by a lot of the choruses in the ’90s and the early 2000s that were just a simple idea that maybe, you repeat once or twice.

BK: Yes or seven, or eight or nine times [laughter]

DZ: Yeah. Depending where you’re at. Yeah. But I grew up in that at my dad’s church. We just had a chorus at the end as a benediction. And I just, it’s a melody that’s sticks truth that sticks in your heart. I wanted to write that. And I was writing it based on Psalm 121, and it was just the literal psalm. It was, “I lift my eyes up to the hills from where does my help come? My help comes from the Lord who made heaven and earth.” And I remember I asked for your help and just said, Bob, can you come and help me with this? Because I want it to, there’s so many good songs based off of Psalm 121. Yes. Yeah. And we’ve heard that a lot. I lift my eyes up to the hills and just said, Bob, how can we see this from just a different, perspective. Same psalm, but… And you really helped me craft that.

BK: I hope so.

DZ: And a lot of it was, “I lift my eyes up to this and see, I need not be afraid.” The hills are not presenting refuge and safety. They’re presenting danger.

BK: That’s right. A threat.

DZ: Threat. We are going to journey forward. And we are going to need to know, will you keep us? Will you sustain us. Will you provide for us? Can we put our hope and trust in you?

BK: Yes.

DZ: And as we said earlier on the podcast, it’s like, that is what we’re coming into every week. Yes. Previous week. Doubts, anxieties, stress trials. We come to Sunday to sit under the word to be refueled, re-aligned to God’s word. And as we go, telling people, you’re gonna experience this again, but God will be there to sustain you.

BK: It’s hard for us to learn that. The Christian life isn’t bad bad times, bad times, then all good times, all good times guys. That’s what Jesus did. He just, it’s all good time. That will be the new heavens and the new earth. But not here. And I wanna address the, just a line we’ve gotten questions about. “He will keep you from all evils. Behind you and before you.”

DZ: Yeah. That’s good.

BK: Right as the song came out, even Sovereign Grace’s pastor emailed me, said, should we be singing that? Isn’t that Old Testament language? He will, it says in verse seven, the Lord will keep you from all evil. He will keep your life. And I’m thinking it’s just scripture [laughter] It’s just, but they would say, well, no, that’s the Old Testament, and we need to see that different because it sounds like health and wealth.

DZ: That’s not what we’re saying.

BK: No, that’s not what we’re saying. And I was, I thought of the passage in Luke 21 where Jesus is talking to his disciples to explain this. And he says in verse 16, “You will be delivered up even by parents and brothers and relatives and friends, and some of you they will put to death.” Okay. Not a good future. “You’ll be hated by all for my name’s sake.” Then he says this, “But not a hair of your head will perish.” Well, I’m thinking.

DZ: Yeah, it sounds contradictory.

BK: I’m thinking if I’m put to death… All my hair is perished.


BK: But what he’s saying is, God’s care for us, the father’s care for us, is so complete and thorough. They might kill you, but not a hair of your head will perish in an eternal sense.

DZ: Ultimate security.

BK: You will be kept from all evils. All that evil would throw against you. Some have said you, you should say he will keep you through all evils. Yes. But the Psalm says He will keep you from all evil. Meaning, God intends for us to feel like, to think that there’s nothing you can do to me, that God has not allowed and that he will not use for my good and his glory.

DZ: Yes.

DZ: He will keep me from all evil. What evil would plot to do against me. God will keep me from it. And that’s the promise we have in Christ. He never sleeps. He’s ordained our steps. He holds the nights. He holds the days He’ll protect us in every instant forever.

DZ: Yeah. Well, and exactly. Forever as you just said. That Psalm continues in verse eight, the Lord will keep you. You’re going out, you’re coming in. From this time forevermore.

BK: Yes. What a way…

DZ: It’s not just a future sustaining, we need it now. But that hope in the futures sustaining of us, that he’ll keep us to the very end, bolsters our faith in the midst of these trials.

BK: Yes. And we need to be sent out with truths like this. You’re going out into a world that hates Jesus, that hates the gospel that probably hates you. And the Lord’s gonna sustain you every step of the way.

DZ: Yeah. Amen.

BK: So that’s what songs are meant to do. We hope this has been encouraging to you. When we write songs, we intend for them to be used because they’re saying something. And if you’re a leader, we hope that you are thinking more about that. Yeah. As the songs you pick, the songs you choose, they’re not just because they’re in a good range or because they seem to be going well. No. They actually say something. Yes. And we hope you see our songs that way, and especially the songs on this album. And we hope it’s been encouragement to you.

DZ: Yeah. Thank you, Bob.

BK: Look forward to joining with you next time.